“I do. Now, I’m done!”
Such is the sharp and straightforward tagline used for My First Ex-Husband, the raucous romp detailing marriages gone awry, from the fervent pen of The View host Joy Behar.
Divulging tales that range from their man being in the mob to themselves switching their sexual preferences – and everything in between – the show spotlights a group of four women (who swap out every four weeks of the run) maneuvering matrimonial mishaps through monologue – all of which are based in truth.
One such woman within the inaugural quartet is the indefatigable Susie Essman. Best known as the no-nonsense Susie Green in HBO’s long-running Curb Your Enthusiasm, Essman received a Critic’s Choice Award nomination for her recurring role as Bobbi Wexler on Broad City, and recently popped in as Deborah’s agent, Elaine, on the Golden Globe-winning Hacks. In addition to various voiceover roles on animated series like The Simpsons and American Dad!, Essman’s also appeared in Those Who Can’t, Bless this Mess, and Law & Order: SVU.
We caught up with the candid comedienne to talk the key to a successful marriage, her decades-long friendship with Behar, why this show means so much to her, and more.
What drew you to this project? Why was this one “the one” to do?
Well, Joy’s my best friend, so that’s the built-in [reason]. She’s been developing these monologues for a long time, and I’ve been involved in it with her throughout [the process], whether it be by reading them or giving her suggestions. We’ve actually done a couple of benefits with them…. and it’s been fun.
They’re poignant, and of course, Joy wrote it, so they’re funny... they’re insightful… it’s [altogether] a really great piece… and it’s an interesting subject to me. I mean, marriage and divorce… what’s more dishy and more juicy than that? (Laughs).
It’s also a short run, so I don’t have to worry about doing it for months on end! (Laughs).
On that note, can you talk about your history with Joy? How is this play different from previous work or projects you’ve done with her?
Well, we’ve been friends for 42 years. We met doing standup together in 1983… we were just both starting out… she had been doing it for a little bit longer than me. And we bonded right away. And just became best friends.
One of the reasons why we’ve been such good friends all these years is that we both have a psychoanalytic bent, and I think that’s been the key to our [close relationship]. We also have a shorthand. We’ll just look at each other and know [what the other’s thinking].
In the early years, we would just be on the phone — and I’m not kidding — for four or five hours a day. We’d talk a lot of business, doing our careers together.
We really had to prove ourselves. It was really hard for women in those days... ‘cause it was a boys’ club. It was a battle. And you’re up there all by yourself. You’re not famous at first, no one’s coming to see you.. you’ve got to win an audience over [by] making them laugh… there are so many variables out of your control. You’re dealing with other comedians, competitiveness, club owners, and drunks [in the audience] from time to time. You’re baring your soul… you’re up there all by yourself… and you’re saying to people, “I think this is funny.” It’s just a very vulnerable place to be… and sometimes, it knocks you down.
And I think we eventually realized that we were stronger together than apart. We were incredibly supportive of each other.
We were always there for each other… and then the friendship just developed… we just had been friends all these years. I always know what she’s doing, she always knows what I’m doing, so it was kind of a no-brainer to do this with her, especially [as part of] the opening cast.
Last November, we did Bonkers in the Boroughs, a series of five plays (which she’s said she originally wrote with me in mind), and that was the first time we did something of that nature.
This is a little bit different – ‘cause they’re monologues, and we’re [therefore] not working together onstage – but it’s still so, so fun.
What about your monologue(s)? Are they relatable to anything you’ve experienced in your life or marriage at all?
No, none of it reminds me of my marriage at all. The stories that I’m telling are extremely different from my experiences! But, you know, (laughs), I’m an actress!!
I’ve also never been divorced, but that’s only because I got married late! Had I married any of the jerks that I went out with [prior], I would’ve definitely gotten divorced, but of course, I was smart enough not to marry them in the first place! (Laughs).
But in terms of life experience, sure. Listen, I’ve been around a long time. And while I’ve been through several divorces with friends, [whether] holding their hand or lending an ear… just being there for several people.
Listen, divorce is traumatic. Even if it happened for a good reason, it’s traumatic every way you look at it, especially if kids are involved. And it’s so complicated.
I’ve been an observer of people’s relationships all my life… from people who stayed together who shouldn’t have stayed together to people who’ve gotten divorced who shouldn’t have [gotten divorced], observation has always been what I’ve done.
When I was younger, I think I was much more judgmental of people’s relationships, and I see it much differently now, in my old age. I’m much more accepting of people’s needs and desires and wants.
And there’s nothing more interesting – and dishy, as I said – to me than people’s relationships with one another.
You know, you [may] see people and have no idea what they see in each other, or why they’re together, and yet, they have a fantastic marriage. There’s such an unknown there… there’s the chemistry, there’s the reality, there’s just so many unknowns about what makes people’s marriages work.
But that’s what great about this piece. [These] are very personal stories. There are eight monologues – four of us and eight monologues – and I think everyone [in the audience] will have a monologue that they [relate to]. Because everybody’s story is individual.
And what about working with these actors? How do you feel you gel together as a group? What is it about this specific cast’s energy that you feel works? How might it be different from the future casts?
We tested out these monologues… not necessarily these ones exactly, but these types… at a benefit with Tovah [Feldshuh], and that was terrific. She’s such a wonderful actress. Adrienne [C. Moore] I don’t know personally, but I’ve seen her work. She’s terrific as well, and I look forward to working with her. Joy, of course, I’m so used to (laughs).
I think [our] chemistry will be great. We did a photoshoot together and we seemed to all like each other there and get along. It’s gonna be great… It’ll be new and interesting and fun.
And it’ll be interesting when four new actresses take over (and then four new actresses take over for them), it’ll be interesting to see their interpretations and the flow is. But they’ll hopefully find a rhythm of their own.
What statement, if any, do you think this play makes about marriage and relationships?
Oh, jeez. (sighs). What I think it has to say is that there are so many different kinds of relationships.
Now, of course, there are some women I know who’ve told me when they were walking down the aisle that they knew it was a huge mistake (laughs), and they went through with it anyway and ultimately ended up divorced... But I think the majority of people go into a marriage wanting it to work [and] wanting it to last forever. And perhaps, maybe it’s the fact that we may think we’ve been sold a bill of goods… from the fantasy [inundating us] in books, television, movies and whatever other media… but as we know, it doesn’t always work out that way.
And then, in terms of “finding the right person,” sometimes the right person when you’re 24 might not be the right person when you’re 45, you know?
Now, it doesn’t mean it wasn’t a successful relationship – it lasted 15 years, and perhaps you raised children – but everything’s of its time, and people are consistently changing and constantly growing.
To expect two people to go through a lifetime of growing and changing at the same time [as maintaining a relationship] with one another, I think, is really, at its heart, a huge task… much more difficult than [one] may realize going through it.
And this [idea] comes to me now because I have so many friends – a crazy amount of friends – who are in distress now after losing their [Southern California] homes. And I think, generally, what people are mourning the most [in] losing their homes is the loss of community. ‘Cause I think community is really important in our lives. Like, it’s not just a house. It’s a community.
And marriage is like that, too. It’s more than just [matrimony]. it’s a partnership. And when or if that ends, you [may] lose your best friend, your buddy, your forever partner…. It’s meaningful in that way. So, I think that part of the poignancy of [divorce] is losing your community when a marriage doesn’t work.
There’s also that aspect of one partner taking one set of friends [and] the other partner taking another set of friends. There’s a lot going on when a marriage breaks up… more than just two people leaving each other.
It’s extremely complicated, and I think most people understand that, but it’s worth it because, at the end of the day, connection is all we have.
Having been happily married to your husband, Jim Harder, for 17 years now, in your opinion, what’s the key to a successful marriage?
I think fluidity [and] being able to adjust your sails when the wind is going in a different direction. I think we all have to compromise and communicate … you know, all the usual stuff.
Sense of humor, for me, is essential. The ability to laugh (and laugh at yourself) is essential.
But I think also [it’s] the ability to see your partner clearly – and not just to see them as an extension of yourself… but to see who they really are.
To make adjustments constantly, because, again, we’re all consistently changing. Don’t expect anyone to be the same person [today] you married [those years ago]. And [know] you wouldn’t want them to be, either. That’d be boring.
Listen, I don’t know any perfect marriages. Relationships are hard, marriage is harder. It really is. It doesn’t always work out, but you can always make the effort. That’s always worth it. And even if it doesn’t work, making the effort is worth it. You can always make the effort.
Getting back to the production, you’ll perform it at the MMAC Theater, within the Manhattan Movement & Arts Center, uptown. Why should people support smaller, independent projects like this show?
I’ll tell you… I just saw a [Broadway] show that was fantastic and big and wonderful with huge production numbers and bright lights and big sets and of course, it was amazing…. but not everything [requires] that.
There’s a lot of theatre that’s very meaningful and can have an impact that is not a big “Broadway” production, per se. And that’s okay.
[It] may still have something to say, and people will be entertained and enjoy themselves.
And it’s nice to have those smaller theaters [as an alternative], because at the end of the day, there’s nothing like live theatre. Nothing like it.
I come from standup, which is also, of course a live medium. And standup on television never does it for me. It just doesn’t translate for me in the way that a live show does.
I think there’s something special when you’re in a dark theater — after the lights go down — and you’re experiencing what’s happening on stage with all the other [audience members] all at the same time. It’s really special.
So, supporting live theatre is essential in that it gives people a sense of community and a sense of shared experience.
And in that sense, smaller theaters are necessary. And sometimes, things go to Broadway that shouldn’t, you know? Some shows really need that intimacy, and this [one] is one of them.
And then, also, Broadway has gotten so expensive. (Sighs) Sometimes you need another option.
There’s a lot going on in the world right now and we’re headed into a new era of uncertainty. Given the age-old adage of “laughter is best medicine,” what do you think it is about humor and comedians that help us navigate hard times?
I think it’s healing, I really do. If you’re going through hard times, it helps. Like, I spoke to a very dear friend who lost his house in the Palisades… the home he raised his children in… and there are so many heirlooms just gone, and other things that were important to them…
But he’s also alive and well. So, we were making jokes and laughing hysterically [through our conversation]. At a certain point, you’ve got to be able to laugh at it, you know? What else are you gonna do? Like, what’s the alternative? (Laughs).
In that same vein, what’s the key to doing it successfully?
I think it’s innate. Humor is innate. Either you have that ability to see life [in that way] or you don’t. To me, humor’s my religion. It’s the prism through which I see the world. Not to say that I think everything’s funny, and it’s not to say that I don’t ever experience tragedy or death or sickness or heartache [etc.], but eventually, I’m able to see the funny in it.
That’s just my point of view. I honestly don’t know where it came from… probably as a kid, it was a survival mechanism. But I realize now, as an adult, it was a great survival mechanism, because it makes you see things from a different perspective. And it just grew from there. It’s just who I am.
What do you hope audiences walk away with after they see this show? What message do you hope to instill in them with this piece?
Ugh, I hate messages. That’s so not my thing. (Laughs). But I guess, if I had to go there, the message is that marriage is messy and complicated, and may not always work out, but there’s life after it If it doesn’t. You know what I mean?
But I guess… what I love about the show is that it’s funny and it’s poignant, simultaneously. It means something, and that makes the funny stuff more [impactful]. The humor comes from the situations… it’s situational character humor (which, as a sidebar, is really my type of humor).
So, yes, I hope people smile. Maybe it’ll make people feel better about their relationships… maybe it’ll make them question themselves and [think], “Perhaps I should leave.” Who the hell would know? I wouldn’t. (Laughs). I don’t know what the ramifications will be… but we’ll certainly find out.
My First Ex-Husband, starring Joy Behar, Susie Essman, Tovah Feldshuh & Adrienne C. Moore, plays the MMAC Theater (248 W. 60th St.) beginning Jan. 29th, with an official opening set for February 6th. The inaugural quartet plays through Feb. 23rd, after which a new group of four will take over. For tickets and/or more information, click here.
